Camelot

[Posts: 498Joined: 20 Feb 2009, 01:49]

It's time we gave this amazing colt due credit. Unbeaten, and the only time he has been under pressure was in the 2000 guineas. After strolling home in the Epsom Derby he had to face really heavy ground in the Curragh, and never looked in danger.
Carping about the quality of his rivals is just anti-Coolmore prejudice. He keeps turning up and winning easily, what more can he do?

[Posts: 4053Joined: 03 Feb 2006, 11:39Location: Sacramento,CA.]

Excellent observation.

[Posts: 1861Joined: 25 Jul 2011, 05:04]

I reckon he's a very good horse who's hard to judge but on the face of it you have nothing to suggest he's some kind of AMAZING horse

The next 5 who followed him home in the Guineas were all beaten next time out and the 4 who ran in the Derby who have run since have all been beaten.

That is not carping those are the facts and until he beats a solid horse eg Danedream or Cirrus D Whatitsname then you my friend are spiraling

[Posts: 366Joined: 07 Aug 2010, 10:37]

I reckon he's a very good horse who's hard to judge but on the face of it you have nothing to suggest he's some kind of AMAZING horse

The next 5 who followed him home in the Guineas were all beaten next time out and the 4 who ran in the Derby who have run since have all been beaten.

The form of the Guineas should turn out ok. Hermival's Ascot run proves him to be a decent miler, he had an excuse in Ireland. French Fifteen couldn't get a crack at them in the French Derby.

My read is that Camelot's Derby win is similar to Workforce's. Workforce beat a pacemaker by 7 lengths in the Derby (Rewilding running far below his best due to greenness, trouble in running, maybe lack of freshness?).
Camelot also has a 2000 Guineas (probably ok form) and now an Irish Derby (form questionable but Born To Sea promising) as well. Workforce was considered a likely star by this stage pre-King George, so most of the Camelot praise is fine with me.

[Posts: 1070Joined: 05 Jun 2010, 14:11]

A top class, versatile colt.
Sadly for him , he is unfortunate to be around at the same time as 2 absolutely exceptional animals, albeit at differing distances, in Frankel and Black Caviar.
I hope that he goes on to emulate Nijinsky and gets the triple crown.

[Posts: 2267Joined: 08 Sep 2005, 16:22]

It's time we gave this amazing colt due credit. Unbeaten, and the only time he has been under pressure was in the 2000 guineas. After strolling home in the Epsom Derby he had to face really heavy ground in the Curragh, and never looked in danger.
Carping about the quality of his rivals is just anti-Coolmore prejudice. He keeps turning up and winning easily, what more can he do?

Stay in training as an older horse and go to Australia to have a go at the Cox Plate or Caulfield Cup.

Hang on, that would mean not retiring at 3 and travelling out of his comfort zone at home, forget it, we don't do that.

[Posts: 1077Joined: 12 Jul 2002, 10:58]

AOB 2008 Melbourne Cup:

Septimus (18th), Alessandro Volta (20th) and Honolulu (21st) were three of the last four to finish, and Bailey (Chief Steward), following local practice, was looking for reasons for their dismal showing.

""Everybody knows the ground was like concrete," O'Brien said. "We could have taken all three horses out.

Yes Aiden it rains in Ireland and can be very dry in Australia.
Amazing stuff.

[Posts: 2032Joined: 06 Jun 2011, 14:34Location: Bury St Edmunds]

AOB 2008 Melbourne Cup:

Septimus (18th), Alessandro Volta (20th) and Honolulu (21st) were three of the last four to finish, and Bailey (Chief Steward), following local practice, was looking for reasons for their dismal showing.

""Everybody knows the ground was like concrete," O'Brien said. "We could have taken all three horses out.

Yes Aiden it rains in Ireland and can be very dry in Australia.
Amazing stuff.

It is interesting to note that the going for the 2008 Melbourne Cup was described as Good. It shows there is wide variance in going descriptions all over the world. Black Caviar had won on "Good to Soft" in Australia but I very much doubt she had ever encountered going like that at Ascot last Saturday even on the training gallops.

[Posts: 4417Joined: 14 Mar 2006, 11:35Location: Doha, Qatar and Co.Clare, Ireland.]

The only thing vaguely interesting about Irish flat racing these days are the Curragh and Leopardstown maiden races. The pattern stuff is a complete yawn fest. It barely resembles sport in the truest sense of the word a lot of the time imo.

Not having a dig at anyone in particular either, that's just the way it is.

Anyway, the proper stuff resumes at Sandown next Saturday.

Good horse that Camelot.

[Posts: 257Joined: 09 Jun 2012, 14:35]

I'm with Aidan O'Brien on this one.

Personally I think Aidan has thrown the horse into the deep end on two occasions this year and in doing so putting the horses reputation on the line.

The horse has been asked to show speed, show stamina, show guts, show a broad range in variations of ground, trip and pace.

They haven't gone easy on the horse, I assume they knew he was special from a young age with comparisons of Saddler's Wells so they have gone out there putting him in these difficult races to prove any indication that he isn't the new Saddler's Wells.

What I'm saying is the horse could of been outpaced in the 2000 Guineas finishing midfield, the horse could of been unbalanced at Epsom finishing without anything to give, could of hated the ground at The Curragh and failed under pressure.

The horse didn't when there was every excuse to lose, he's simply the greatest they've produced.

They've asked for individual attributes of the horse to be shown which he has delivered and if you were to send a mare to them wanting speed he'll give you that, if you wanted stamina he'll give you that, if you're worried about ground he'll take those worries away, if you're worried about class then look at his racing record, if you wanted to foal a 10f racehorse he'll do that for you, if you wanted size and scope he's got that, if you're worried about Montjeu temprement he doesn't habituate any of those hereditary symptoms.

The ultimate racehorse.

[Posts: 4053Joined: 03 Feb 2006, 11:39Location: Sacramento,CA.]

Yes but he has not run against older horses and has not gone to the breeder's cup!He keeps on beating the same three year olds. Perhaps when he learns to relax next year he will take on older horses.

[Posts: 12581Joined: 22 Dec 2007, 19:24]

Yes but he has not run against older horses and has not gone to the breeder's cup!He keeps on beating the same three year olds. Perhaps when he learns to relax next year he will take on older horses.

It's a shame he isn't a filly, beat up inferior rivals in numerous non-events and then take on good horses just once a year in the Breeders Cup.

[Posts: 498Joined: 20 Feb 2009, 01:49]

Only beaten 3 year-olds? At this stage in Nijinsky's career he had only beaten 3 year-olds. Camelot has been highly tried at a distance too short, in heavy ground, and at the ultimate test for 3 year-olds, the Epsom Derby. What more can he do?