Chasing at 4 years old

[Posts: 134Joined: 03 Apr 2010, 21:49]

Is it right that horses are sent chasing at 4 years old?

[Posts: 461Joined: 30 Oct 2011, 10:43Location: North Yorkshire]

From my personal point of view I would say no. I've always thought that hurdling at 3 was a bit tough on a young horse, and think the same of chasing at 4. I'm not sure a horse's development is finished by then, and it must give them a hard time physically.

[Posts: 1503Joined: 30 Oct 2007, 14:08]

Doesn't appear to have done Kauto Star too much harm.

[Posts: 134Joined: 03 Apr 2010, 21:49]

Yes, you're right about that PC. But he ran in his first chase at the end of his fourth year, and had only raced a few times over hurdles previously. I'm more concerned about young horses off the flat who have had many races before being plunged into (bad enough) hurdles and (much worse) chases.

[Posts: 728Joined: 09 Jan 2011, 14:48]

Edredon Bleu, Flagship Uberalles, Tresor De Mai, Voy Por Ustedes, Monkerhostin, L'Ami, Royal Auclair, Sleeping Night, Master Minded, Long Run and Madison Du Berlais all raced over fences as four year olds before lengthy and successful careers. Neptune Collonges began his chasing career at three!

I'm sure that for all of these successes, there will be unfortunate disasters (Draborgie springs to mind). Nevertheless, I don't have enough in the way of data to discern just how much of a physiological impact going over fences has on a young horse (or racing from two years old for that matter).

I wonder if anybody does...

[Posts: 1503Joined: 30 Oct 2007, 14:08]

Yes, you're right about that PC. But he ran in his first chase at the end of his fourth year, and had only raced a few times over hurdles previously. I'm more concerned about young horses off the flat who have had many races before being plunged into (bad enough) hurdles and (much worse) chases.

I don't know enough about the physical capabilities of horses to be honest - i probably shouldn't have posted. Nethertheless, i'm aware i've probably posted an exception rather than a rule, i wasn't trying to be a smart-harris.

It does seem generally accepted that French horses are more precocious than UK&Ireland equivalents. No idea why. Is it a myth just because they are campaigned that way, whereas ours are not?

[Posts: 728Joined: 09 Jan 2011, 14:48]

Is it a myth just because they are campaigned that way, whereas ours are not?

I'd have thought it would take much longer but apparently, the selective breeding of Atlantic salmon leads to an increase of 30% in weight per generation. It's a different kettle of fish but perhaps if horses are bred specifically to be precocious over fences then over a few generations, it's feasible that the characteristic is tuned into the genes.

[Posts: 1503Joined: 30 Oct 2007, 14:08]

Is it a myth just because they are campaigned that way, whereas ours are not?

I'd have thought it would take much longer but apparently, the selective breeding of Atlantic salmon leads to an increase of 30% in weight per generation. It's a different kettle of fish but perhaps if horses are bred specifically to be precocious over fences then over a few generations, it's feasible that the characteristic is tuned into the genes.

Interesting. I have read on numerous occasions that French Breds don't "last" as well as UK&Ire NH horses. Is Kauto Star the exception to this "rule" or is the "rule" nonsense?

[Posts: 1302Joined: 17 Nov 2009, 01:13Location: Virginia]

Elkridge (1942), Oedipus (1950), Barnabys Bluff (1962), Bon Nouvel (1956), and Life's Illusion (filly, 1975) all recieved the Champion Steeplechaser title (back when we actually had steeplechases) as 4yos. It certainly didn't hurt Elkridge, he was known as "the iron horse of steeplechasing", raced till age 13 with 121 starts and retired sound.

[Posts: 1953Joined: 20 Feb 2006, 12:12Location: Bristol]

Kauto Star is the exception to most rules.

[Posts: 1503Joined: 30 Oct 2007, 14:08]

When did USA stop having Steeplechases Miss?

[Posts: 1302Joined: 17 Nov 2009, 01:13Location: Virginia]

When did USA stop having Steeplechases Miss?

They switched to portable hurdles in the mid-1970s. You see, up until the 50s and 60s flat turf racing didn't exist in the US, but many tracks had jumps courses. By the 1970s tracks were ripping out their old jumps courses (Aqueduct, Belmont, Monmouth, Saratoga...) so they could run flat races on them. So to keep the few fixtures they still had on these tracks, and to reduce the cost burden on smaller hunt/point-to-point meets (portable fences are much much cheaper than the year-round maintenance of permanent birch fences) the NSA decided to switch to National Fences. There are still a handful of meets with natural fences, but the big stakes are run on hurdles.
Saratoga, 1933 (that's Battleship in front)


Saratoga, 2011


Timber races, however have thankfully remained unchanged over the past 100 years.

[Posts: 2200Joined: 14 May 2001, 19:05]

I'm surprised nobody's yet mentioned Golden Miller, who ran in 3 chases as a 4-y-o, including one where I believe, in terms of his calendar age, he wasn't quite 4 years old.

Basically, as long as a horse isn't over-raced or over-faced, and is sufficently mature, then I don't see too much harm in it.

Of course, if a horse is raced hard and often over fences when young, there's bound to be a tendency for them to peak, and therefore decline, sooner than a horse who isn't - there's only so much juice in an orange.

I remember Kilmore winning the Grand National 50 years ago when he was 12, and he was at his best at that age. He wasn't broken in until he was 6 or 7.